Acknowledging where my mind has gone to

[JoaquinSardonBisso]

Hi,

I am new here. Very happy I found a good forum.

When I am focusing on my breath, and a thought appears, FPIFW tells me I should acknowledge where my mine has gone to. Does that mean:

1) Say to myself: thinking? And then come back to my breath.

or 2) Say to myself: thinking about X? And then come back to my breath.

Thanks for the time.

Joaquín

[JonW]

Hi Joaquín,
Welcome to the forum. I look forward to getting to know you on here.
Regards your question, I wouldn't say there's a wrong answer but I'd go for 1 over 2. With 2, by identifying the content of the thought, there's a risk in getting wrapped up in it - rather than simply acknowledging the act of thinking.
Does that make any sense?
Cheers,
Jon

[Babywhale]

Hi Joaquin - Welcome. I'm also new to mindfulness, and am following an 8-week course via the NHS. I also have read FPIAFW and have so far used tracks 1, 2 and 8, along with a body scan meditation (30 minutes long) given to me by my teachers.

Your question is a good one, and has got me thinking that 1 is better than 2 (as John says), but there's a space between 1 and 2 (the 1.5) that might also be valuable.

After about 10-15 body scans, for example, I am finding that my mind is wandering less because I reign it in more having recognised that I've left the present moment. I would say that I give it a small moment's reflective thought, acknowledging where it went, and then momentarily classifying it (labeling the thought) before letting it go and returning to the present. Although each time is slightly different, I would say that the recognition/acknowledgement through to labeling and letting it go lasts for about 2-3 seconds, sometimes shorter.

I don't (yet) have a labeling classification system, and don't plan to develop anything formal like that. A few themes which seem to be developing include:

1. Totally random thought or question e.g. What colour was that coat Jim liked?
2. Planning idea e.g. Need to get a Mother's Day card this week
3. Rumination e.g. Why didn't I say that to him?
4. Worry/Paranoia e.g. Is that what my boss *really* meant, and is my boss therefore trying to shaft me really?
5. Judgement or thought about the Body Scan itself e.g. This is frustrating, or "phew, I'm half way through, the guide is about to say this next".....

As I say, they are brief labels which "spring to mind" at the point I acknowledge the mind drifting or chattering, and I don't label or entertain the thought content too much or for too long. Most of my thoughts, although different in content, tend to easily fall into themes/classes, so the acknowledgement and letting go is quite quick and doesn't involve exploring the content any further, and I don't tie myself in knots trying to understand the thought, or what might have led me to think it.

In these early weeks of mindfulness training I am consciously taking a mindful approach to everyday living outside of meditation e.g. When driving, going for a walk, in a shop, showering, pottering about the house and, yes, I am reigning in mind-chatter, even if it isn't upsetting/traumatic rumination chatter but simply random thoughts.

I see it as being all part of the conscious training about paying attention purposefully to the present moment. It does feel a little self-disciplining at times (because my mind is so used to drifting off for long periods into worry and rumination), but I don't feel like a mind-empty zombie either. On the contrary, I'm feeling as though there's something for my attention to be drawn to at all times, whether its the cool wind, the soft warmth of the sun, the sound of birds, the clock on the wall, the rumble of traffic, the stiffness in my knee, the type of lighting in the room, the feel of the cold steering wheel under my hands.....and any time I recognize that my mind has wandered and i was able to acknowledge it and reign it back, it feels good inside rather than frustrating. The breath is a key anchor, as is my physical contact with the ground, or the chair.

So the long answer to your very short question IMO is to be satisfied with a 1, but also be content with a 1.5. Treat the content of the thought as 'an object' and don't pay it any further attention once you've noticed yourself noticing it.

[Gareth]

I'll echo Jon's sentiment and go for a 1, although Babywhale makes some excellent points, too.

[Mindsfull]

I've thought lots on this also. And I don't want to confuse things anymore so would say going with 'thinking' would be good.

But on the subject FPIAFW suggests labelling the thought such as 'thinking thinking' or 'worrying worrying' or 'planning planning' etc

Where as Headspace does a few different layers.
Where layer 1. would be the choice of what is pulling the attention in mind or the body and then labelling it 'thinking' or 'feeling'
Layer 2 would be the emotion attached 'anxiety/sadness/'etc
Layer 3 you would then label whether it's 'positive' or 'negative'

Another similar one is to constantly note while the thought is happening every 5 seconds until is dissipates such as 'planning'... 'planning'

I've even heard of practitioners that don't like the idea of noting or labelling because that in itself is a thought of the thought that should just be observed...?

But I kind of like just to do 'thinking' or sometimes I may do 'thinking' and then I may note 'worrying, worrying'.

Sorry, I'm aware that's not always helpful but I think it's interesting to see the different ways and possibly find what you prefer as you progress

[monkey]

Hi Joaquín and welcome. I've also wondered about this. Now I tend to do whatever seems possible while still remaining mindful at the time. So sometimes my mind is fairly still or clear and I can see and label 'worrying about...' and be aware of the emotion. Sometimes it's busier or cloudier and I can get 'worrying'. Sometimes it's an onslaught and I practice by trying to come back to the breath and body or sounds again and again, it's very hard at those times even to register 'thinking'. I find this works for me and that if I try to label when things are full on it ends up becoming very controlling and tense.

[Matt Y]

I'm going to add a completely different perspective here and suggest that of options 1 and 2, the latter is nearly always more useful.
I would also suggest that there are many more options; a 3 and 4 and 5... and so on.

It would necessitate a very long post for me to explain my reasoning for this outlook, so I will include a brief explanation and then some links to where I've previously written about this.

Basically though, Option 1, where you say to yourself "thinking" and then come back to the breath, can be useful for some thoughts. However, when your thoughts are intrusive, persistent or problematic I think you'll find that this technique rarely works very well. Your mind will be drawn frequently into long trains of thought. (This is not necessarily a problem, unless your thinking is deluded or self-critical). By saying "thinking" you interrupt the thought and therefore can not remain mindful of it (to any degree). You prevent yourself from developing an awareness of how the thought arises, what fuels it and what conditions lead to the thought changing. In other words, by dismissing the thought so cursorily, you miss the opportunity to learn about your thinking processes. This almost guarantees that you will get caught up in the same cycles of thinking over and over again, forever. However, when you allow your thinking to go on (not necessarily for ever) you will probably discover a number of things. Firstly, that most thoughts go away without you having to label (or do anything to them). Secondly, that if you let your thinking go on, you will naturally become aware of it (and less embedded in it) over time. Thirdly, that whether thoughts are present or not is not nearly so important as how you relate to them.

There's a lot more to this than what I've just explained so please do refer to the links below. More importantly, experiment with the idea of letting yourself think during meditation practice (you will anyway!) Challenge yourself - and what you may previously have heard about meditation and mindfulness - to explore these ideas and discover your own truth about it.

Finally, I'd just like to say that since I began teaching this more thought-friendly approach to meditation my students have struggled far less and enjoyed meditation significantly more. It has worked particularly well with those people who were highly anxious or overwhelmed by their thoughts.

For a general overview on what to do with thinking in meditation
http://melbournemeditationcentre.com.au ... editation/

For more options (in addition to 1 and 2 above) refer to:
http://melbournemeditationcentre.com.au ... -thoughts/
http://melbournemeditationcentre.com.au ... -thoughts/

For a guided meditation that explores these ideas listen in at:
http://melbournemeditationcentre.com.au ... -thoughts/

[JoaquinSardonBisso]

Thanks a lot to everyone. I found very usefull your comments.

I am deciding to just go with "thinking" right now, though doing this acknowlegment slowly so I get to subconsciously (not consciously-labeling) feel my emotions.

Cheers!

[Innerchatter]

i generally go for option one and just say thinking, unless I'm worrying, if I'm worrying i say worrying, I'm not entirely sure why i give worrying its own label, but it seems to work