Seeking help

[Daisy]

Hi again Jon

I've read your post properly now and also the links you gave me. I really do understand what you are getting at, and not just because I've read so much about meditation I don't think. Intellectually I understand but also I have been practicing it on and off for years....but the past few weeks/months more so. Pretty much daily (in an effort to 'get me through a tough patch at work'), until as I think I said in a previous post, I really did start to feel my anxiety levels shoot up - not whilst I was actually meditating but during the day. I have had clinical anxiety for years and had the 'breakdown' you mentioned years ago....but also another meltdown a few months ago, due to work/family pressures. I admit I started regular meditation to try to help me deal with the anxiety, which initially it did, but it was as though the thoughts and rumination became louder during the day (whilst not meditating) and pushed up. Frankly it was crap and I had to stop the formal meditation. I have had a couple of weeks of sleeping lots and trying not to put too much pressure on myself in any way. I do feel better. And I most definately have not given up on mindfulness...far from it. I will however state my point again that if someone has a clinical condition - depression or anxiety for instance - much of the time care should be taken to find the most appropriate approach if they are considering trying meditation, whether it's mindfulness or not. I can only speak of my own experience, and I am slowly allowing the solution to reveal itself so that I can get back on track with my anxiety and then also my meditation practice.

With debilitating anxiety/nerves, when you have a wee meltdown (doesn't happen often!!) it can take months for the ripples and aftershocks to die down and time is of the essence. My instincts are telling me to be gentle with myself, and lean towards compassion and tenderness. The last thing I need is to tell myself or to be told that I'm doing 'it' wrong. I know the ins and outs of my condition so very well, it's just that I've never got so deep into mindfulness before, let alone whilst in the throws of continual anxiety attacks. But my gut feeling, despite the fact that mindfulness most definately appeared to open a floodgate or two, is that it's good. Something is happening - a gap is growing between me and the thought, if you know what I mean. I've read just about everything Eckhart Tolle's written and I really do understand what this means...maybe I'm just a slow learner

I hope I've explained things well enough! I've probably left out something crucial but hopefully you'll get the gist of what I mean Jon. Thanks again for your reply and again, it's great to write things down. It really helps to clarify things, for me anyway

[kellie@writingmoment]

Hi Daisy,

I completed the course Jon mentioned through the Williams/Penman book and found it very helpful. The other thing I found helpful was the advice that anxiety has its use and mindfulness helps us better manage the anxiety.

Cheers,
Kellie

[quirky_friend]

Daisy, I'm also coming to this from a long history of depression and anxiety. I'm using mindfulness in adjunct to meds and (hopefully) a good therapeutic relationship with a counselor.
One thing my new therapist added to the mix was how my long history of depression has attuned me to going into thinking rather than feeling at the slightest hint of strong feelings. She's very keen I use mindfulness to practice sitting still with feelings

[Daisy]

Thanks quirky friend and Kellie. QF that's interesting, and you are so lucky to have found a professional person who can guide you through the fragility of applying mindfulness to your treatment .... and thanks for sharing 'sitting still with feelings' rather than launching down the thinking channel. I recently remembered something Ruby Wax said - when you are in the midst of an acute episode of depression (or anxiety), rather than try a new thing like meditation only to feel a failure if you can't 'do it', dig out the box sets .... in other words I think what she meant was retreat and rest, let time pass and be kind. Then when the fog lifts you can approach the idea of learning about mindfulness. I'd love to hear how your journey goes and what you gain from it. I think my fog is lifting so will see what unfolds on my journey. xx

[quirky_friend]

Daisy, I started mindfulness practice just at the start of an acute depression with added anxiety for extra interest. I'm 9 weeks on and just progressing beyond the body scan in any meaningful way now.
The body scan was a good anchor during a horrible experience. I'm still getting my medication fully stable and can have tough days, but I've now set a goal of 25-45 min of mindfulness practice on 6 of 7 days each week.
I've set reminders for three breathing space episodes at work.
My biggest struggle is the good experience diary, but my plan is to try and get 5 recorded before next Wednesday which is my next therapy session and use some of the time to work out why if I'm not managing.
My current pattern I'm trying to be gentle with is I'm completely oversensitive to any sensation of anxiety. It sends me into a panic that I'm not getting any better.
Oh, and my other "find" on mindfulness is tapestry... The rhythmic pattern of handling the needle is great for immediacy!

[Daisy]

Hi quirky friend, it sounds as if you are taking things nice and slow with meditation which to me sounds the best plan. Although you are taking things slowly though, for me personally I don't think your particular approach would be the right one, not until I was out of the 'acute' stage. There's a few words you used which, again for myself only, ring alarm bells..."struggle", "goal", "plan" and few more. As I said in previous posts, I've fairly recently learned that for me the best thing is to as much as possible float through the stressful period with absolute minimum of demands on myself, and that includes a mindfulness practice! Then when the dust settles as it were, I can consider the possibility of introducing a formal practice. As Jon Kabat Zinn put it on one of his cds, approach the breath as you would approach a small shy animal sitting on a tree stump in the middle of a clearing in a forest....or something like that haha. Well that's how I want to approach mindfulness. Sorry this is all about me!! It just goes to show though that we are all different, one size doesn't fit all and it's so so important to do what is right for yourself. IT's great that you are applying helpful strategies in your work environment - that's brill. Good luck with your journey quirky friend! xx

[quirky_friend]

Hi Daisy, no worries - we are all different
Recently I heard Mark Williams in a pod cast about the people who had the best outcomes from mindfulness practice in depression, were those who did their practice regularly even when they don't enjoy the process of practice and learning.
It really hit me I could easily find a lot of excuses to not practice. So I need to work with that pattern and habit

[Daisy]

That's a good point about regular practice and is bound to be the case; anxiety isn't depression though, although there's often an overlap. Crucially, I was talking in my original post about anxiety, and not depression. I think Shamash Alidina (spelling!) has a new book which may be a more tailored approach for folks who are anxious and/or under a lot of stress...also Ruby Wax's new one too. I've also been really enjoying Paul Gilbert's book - he's a mindfulness compassion chap Yes, I probably read too many books but I'm an avid reader and find it all fascinating. I will be tip toeing into a mindfulness practice soon....watch this space!