I can't add much to the wonderful advice that you've already had from Mick (piedwagtail91)
I just wanted to come to something that struck me from your first post. This: "I know i can be better than this."
It made me think of something that I read in our interview with Breathworks program director Singhashri, that get get taught on their courses: "In order to get from A to B, you first have to be at A."
As it so often does with mindfulness, it comes down to acceptance. Accept and embrace the place where you are at right now, so that you can move forward. Fiendishly difficult I know, but this is the paradox that is mindfulness.
So near and so very far
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piedwagtail91
- Posts: 613
- Practice Mindfulness Since: 0- 3-2011
- Location: Lancashire witch country
as gareth says, it's about acceptance and that's really hard at first.
this is probably going to sound silly but if you can, try to beging to see how you relate to yourself as your first priority.
i know the food is dominating but see if you can let that slip down to second importance.
if you imaging that you're out in a massive park on a sunny day, all your best lightest summer stuff on, no brolly, no waterproof ( i know sunny and uk is really difficult to imagine
) and suddenly you're stuck in a torrential downpour . what can you do with no shelter and no protection?
you've no choice but to accept that you're getting soaked, you don't like it but you accept it.
more difficult with food, a lot more difficult, but if you begin to allow yourself to relate to food in a similar way it'll give you more mindspace to help relate to yourself better.
one way to relate to the food is to acknowledge it, say kindly to yourself, i know that i'm eating, i know that i don't really want to , but that's just how it is at this time,i'm aware of it and i'm working on it. (probably better you use your own words
)
one way to help you relate to yourself is to become more aware of the tyrant or bully of an inner voice.
we all have them, or had them depending on practice.
when i was set this task i kept a pen and paper close to hand ( several pens and paper - i was good at self hate)
every time you judge or criticise write it down, word for word.
even if it's just 'idiot' or moron' or 'shouldn't have done that', write it all down.
after a few hours, or sooner if you run out of pens and paper, sit down somewhere by yourself, somewhere you feel safe and comfortable.
And then begin to read the words.
read them slowly and dwell on each word for a few moments to see how it makes you feel.
could you say those words to a close friend who was struggling, would a close friend say them to you?
you probably won't get very far before the tears start, when that happens don't feel bad or try to stop them, let them flow.
your body knows how to look after itself and that's just what it's doing.
you are safe when this happens. (kristin neff explains this in her book)
try if you can to put one hand or both on your chest over your heart and feel that touch.
really feel that touch, is it warm or tingling?
feel the warmth spread from your hands to your heart, feel that connection, that's self compassion.
dwell on that warmth and let it spread to wherever you hurt in your body.
let the warmth soothe the pain.
when you feel ready then take 2 or 3 deeper soothing breaths and bring the practice to a close.
if the bully in everyone's head was a good thing , then everyone would be perfect by now.
but we're not .
we're all human, we're all flawed in some way.
my way of punishing myself was exercise.
starting to practice self compassion was, for me, really difficult, it took me 12 months to be comfortable with it.
i'd had 27 or so years of giving myself a very hard time.
it's long process but it is worth it.
by allowing the food - your weapon? - to slide to second place and placing relationship to yourself first not only gives you more mindspace but also may be the answer to the food issue.
as you become more self compassionate , you'll feel less bad about yourself, that could , even without you knowing or being aware of it, allow you to eat less.
one day you may go to the fridge and wonder where all the food's come from,
approaching this with kindness and compassion could allow you to break the food link with a lot less effort and by encouraging yourself rather that beating yourself up.
don't rush into this, you'll know when the time is right, you'll feel it.
that'll be the best time to start.
don't force yourself to do this because if you force it then it's not self compassion, it's your inner bully in disguise.
you'll know when to start and if you've struggled for a while with this then you are plenty strong and brave enough to do this.
mick
this is probably going to sound silly but if you can, try to beging to see how you relate to yourself as your first priority.
i know the food is dominating but see if you can let that slip down to second importance.
if you imaging that you're out in a massive park on a sunny day, all your best lightest summer stuff on, no brolly, no waterproof ( i know sunny and uk is really difficult to imagine
) and suddenly you're stuck in a torrential downpour . what can you do with no shelter and no protection?you've no choice but to accept that you're getting soaked, you don't like it but you accept it.
more difficult with food, a lot more difficult, but if you begin to allow yourself to relate to food in a similar way it'll give you more mindspace to help relate to yourself better.
one way to relate to the food is to acknowledge it, say kindly to yourself, i know that i'm eating, i know that i don't really want to , but that's just how it is at this time,i'm aware of it and i'm working on it. (probably better you use your own words
)one way to help you relate to yourself is to become more aware of the tyrant or bully of an inner voice.
we all have them, or had them depending on practice.
when i was set this task i kept a pen and paper close to hand ( several pens and paper - i was good at self hate)
every time you judge or criticise write it down, word for word.
even if it's just 'idiot' or moron' or 'shouldn't have done that', write it all down.
after a few hours, or sooner if you run out of pens and paper, sit down somewhere by yourself, somewhere you feel safe and comfortable.
And then begin to read the words.
read them slowly and dwell on each word for a few moments to see how it makes you feel.
could you say those words to a close friend who was struggling, would a close friend say them to you?
you probably won't get very far before the tears start, when that happens don't feel bad or try to stop them, let them flow.
your body knows how to look after itself and that's just what it's doing.
you are safe when this happens. (kristin neff explains this in her book)
try if you can to put one hand or both on your chest over your heart and feel that touch.
really feel that touch, is it warm or tingling?
feel the warmth spread from your hands to your heart, feel that connection, that's self compassion.
dwell on that warmth and let it spread to wherever you hurt in your body.
let the warmth soothe the pain.
when you feel ready then take 2 or 3 deeper soothing breaths and bring the practice to a close.
if the bully in everyone's head was a good thing , then everyone would be perfect by now.
but we're not .
we're all human, we're all flawed in some way.
my way of punishing myself was exercise.
starting to practice self compassion was, for me, really difficult, it took me 12 months to be comfortable with it.
i'd had 27 or so years of giving myself a very hard time.
it's long process but it is worth it.
by allowing the food - your weapon? - to slide to second place and placing relationship to yourself first not only gives you more mindspace but also may be the answer to the food issue.
as you become more self compassionate , you'll feel less bad about yourself, that could , even without you knowing or being aware of it, allow you to eat less.
one day you may go to the fridge and wonder where all the food's come from,
approaching this with kindness and compassion could allow you to break the food link with a lot less effort and by encouraging yourself rather that beating yourself up.
don't rush into this, you'll know when the time is right, you'll feel it.
that'll be the best time to start.
don't force yourself to do this because if you force it then it's not self compassion, it's your inner bully in disguise.
you'll know when to start and if you've struggled for a while with this then you are plenty strong and brave enough to do this.
mick
-
GirlcalledGed
- Posts: 25
Thank you again, I was a bit overwhelmed with your kindness when first reading the posts.
My mind has shifted the last few days. I am eating addictively but am more accepting that this is just how it is right now, in this moment. I am not wishing it was different or regretting it after or feeling ashamed of myself. It is what it is. It doesn't feel good physically or spiritually but I am accepting of that too. I can't help but hope there's some value in it though, that it is temporary and will 'work'. But maybe not, maybe this is as good as it gets.
I don't think I am so explicit with negative self talk. I worked really hard on this years ago before finding mindfulness. Sometimes horrible stuff jumps out and I can usually examine it and realise it's not right.
It's more feelings than words with me maybe. Feeling crappy, guilty, depressed, anxious etc. they are rubbish for their own sake and are a trigger for addictive eating are negative thoughts always linked? Do you think I am not picking up on them?
Thank you again xxxx
My mind has shifted the last few days. I am eating addictively but am more accepting that this is just how it is right now, in this moment. I am not wishing it was different or regretting it after or feeling ashamed of myself. It is what it is. It doesn't feel good physically or spiritually but I am accepting of that too. I can't help but hope there's some value in it though, that it is temporary and will 'work'. But maybe not, maybe this is as good as it gets.
I don't think I am so explicit with negative self talk. I worked really hard on this years ago before finding mindfulness. Sometimes horrible stuff jumps out and I can usually examine it and realise it's not right.
It's more feelings than words with me maybe. Feeling crappy, guilty, depressed, anxious etc. they are rubbish for their own sake and are a trigger for addictive eating are negative thoughts always linked? Do you think I am not picking up on them?
Thank you again xxxx
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GirlcalledGed
- Posts: 25
Except I haven't meditated for over a week. Not at all. And now imnsomnia is back. My heart is pounding, am trying to be accepting of not meditating and self sabotaging in that way. Right this moment I regret it though. Wish I could go back in time and take different actions that would haveto encouragef deep restful sleep night now
Y
Y
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piedwagtail91
- Posts: 613
- Practice Mindfulness Since: 0- 3-2011
- Location: Lancashire witch country
i think it's great that you can relate to it like this, thats a great step forwards.
this is an observation , it's not a criticism. a lot of what you're written is around not being present.
i hope this is constructive as thats what i'm hoping it is.
"I can't help but hope there's some value in it though, that it is temporary and will 'work'. But maybe not, maybe this is as good as it gets. "
you're almost there with accepting this, there's still a bit of judgement (But maybe not, maybe this is as good as it gets) lingering in this but that's to be expected.
don't worry about it, it's not a criticism.
where you're at at this moment is plenty good enough, try not to compare to the past , or project into the future.
try ,if you can, to learn from it but try not to overthink it and bring emotions on.
"I don't think I am so explicit with negative self talk. I worked really hard on this years ago before finding mindfulness. Sometimes horrible stuff jumps out and I can usually examine it and realise it's not right."
this is great,
i took me ages getting to that stage.
usually thoughts and emotions are linked. they can feed of each other to escalate things each intensifying the other and spiralling .
you have a lot going on at the moment so things are easy to miss.
as you practice, things become clearer, but it takes time.
i found myself stressed out and almost took it out by 'over checking' the dog on the lead. i was lost in thought about the situation and noticed just in time how much stress i was holding in my body. once i saw it and let it go i was able to see how the thoughts had made a mountain out of a molehill.
my situation didn't change but i was able to see it more clearly.
sometimes you notice things in your body, sometimes in the mind.
"Right this moment I regret it though. Wish I could go back in time and take different actions that would have to encourage deep restful sleep night now"
it's understandable, we all regret things.
but regretting is being in the past, it's thoughts again.
by regretting/thinking about missing a week you're living/reliving it and you don't need to.
you're being very hard on yourself for no reason.
as you've written regretting it won't fix it.
i know this can be hard but it's best to let the past go.
sitting and meditating is something that i don't like to miss.
but somedays it may be unavoidable.
whilst i wouldn't advise stopping meditating i would say that sometimes the actual sitting can be replaced by other things, at least short term.
watching the rain splashing in the puddles and bring awareness to that, and then back to that when your mind wanders is just as good as sitting with your eyes closed and keeping returning to your breath.
there are lots of anchors to use, ones that you can build into your day.
trying something different can help renew your enthusiasm.
i was told to watch very closely as i poured water from a kettle into a cup, watching the tea bag and the water in the cup.
it may seem like nothing but it's still mindful and in the moment.
if you can , and if you use them, try to let go of "should have" and "could have".
they're just a pair of boxing gloves.
the best thing for unpleasant memories is to learn from them then they're not wasted.
pleasant memories can be enjoyed!
when you feel anxious have a listen to what your body is telling you, you've noticed your heart is pounding, what else do you notice, have a look around your body, bring a sense of curiosity as you do.
feel what anxiety, or any of the other emotions, feels like , try to let go of the thoughts.
the insomnia.
can you meditate before bed?
that can help to clear your mind enough to let you get off to sleep.
if that still doesn't help then maybe if you're up for it you could try some of the breathing practices used in yoga?
nadi shodana is a very relaxing technique and simple to learn.
it takes so much concentration that there's no space left for random thoughts , so will give you a clear head and help to calm and relax you, so help you sleep.
try not to watch tv or drink coffee just before bed, the coffee can stimulate and the tv will full your head full of thoughts, hence the meditate before bed,
i've found peppermint tea relaxes me and makes me very sleepy.
but i'm hyper sensitive to meds. and now it seems tea.
it may help but watch out for it reacting with any meds.
sorry if all this sounds like criticism but i really mean it to be helpful, just observations , nothing more.
don't set time limits, be kind.
i know very little of this sounds like mindfulness, but it's sometimes best to use whatever works until you feel ok, them maybe go back to 'mindfulness'
take care
mick
this is an observation , it's not a criticism. a lot of what you're written is around not being present.
i hope this is constructive as thats what i'm hoping it is.
"I can't help but hope there's some value in it though, that it is temporary and will 'work'. But maybe not, maybe this is as good as it gets. "
you're almost there with accepting this, there's still a bit of judgement (But maybe not, maybe this is as good as it gets) lingering in this but that's to be expected.
don't worry about it, it's not a criticism.
where you're at at this moment is plenty good enough, try not to compare to the past , or project into the future.
try ,if you can, to learn from it but try not to overthink it and bring emotions on.
"I don't think I am so explicit with negative self talk. I worked really hard on this years ago before finding mindfulness. Sometimes horrible stuff jumps out and I can usually examine it and realise it's not right."
this is great,
i took me ages getting to that stage.
usually thoughts and emotions are linked. they can feed of each other to escalate things each intensifying the other and spiralling .
you have a lot going on at the moment so things are easy to miss.
as you practice, things become clearer, but it takes time.
i found myself stressed out and almost took it out by 'over checking' the dog on the lead. i was lost in thought about the situation and noticed just in time how much stress i was holding in my body. once i saw it and let it go i was able to see how the thoughts had made a mountain out of a molehill.
my situation didn't change but i was able to see it more clearly.
sometimes you notice things in your body, sometimes in the mind.
"Right this moment I regret it though. Wish I could go back in time and take different actions that would have to encourage deep restful sleep night now"
it's understandable, we all regret things.
but regretting is being in the past, it's thoughts again.
by regretting/thinking about missing a week you're living/reliving it and you don't need to.
you're being very hard on yourself for no reason.
as you've written regretting it won't fix it.
i know this can be hard but it's best to let the past go.
sitting and meditating is something that i don't like to miss.
but somedays it may be unavoidable.
whilst i wouldn't advise stopping meditating i would say that sometimes the actual sitting can be replaced by other things, at least short term.
watching the rain splashing in the puddles and bring awareness to that, and then back to that when your mind wanders is just as good as sitting with your eyes closed and keeping returning to your breath.
there are lots of anchors to use, ones that you can build into your day.
trying something different can help renew your enthusiasm.
i was told to watch very closely as i poured water from a kettle into a cup, watching the tea bag and the water in the cup.
it may seem like nothing but it's still mindful and in the moment.
if you can , and if you use them, try to let go of "should have" and "could have".
they're just a pair of boxing gloves.
the best thing for unpleasant memories is to learn from them then they're not wasted.
pleasant memories can be enjoyed!
when you feel anxious have a listen to what your body is telling you, you've noticed your heart is pounding, what else do you notice, have a look around your body, bring a sense of curiosity as you do.
feel what anxiety, or any of the other emotions, feels like , try to let go of the thoughts.
the insomnia.
can you meditate before bed?
that can help to clear your mind enough to let you get off to sleep.
if that still doesn't help then maybe if you're up for it you could try some of the breathing practices used in yoga?
nadi shodana is a very relaxing technique and simple to learn.
it takes so much concentration that there's no space left for random thoughts , so will give you a clear head and help to calm and relax you, so help you sleep.
try not to watch tv or drink coffee just before bed, the coffee can stimulate and the tv will full your head full of thoughts, hence the meditate before bed,
i've found peppermint tea relaxes me and makes me very sleepy.
but i'm hyper sensitive to meds. and now it seems tea.
it may help but watch out for it reacting with any meds.
sorry if all this sounds like criticism but i really mean it to be helpful, just observations , nothing more.
don't set time limits, be kind.
i know very little of this sounds like mindfulness, but it's sometimes best to use whatever works until you feel ok, them maybe go back to 'mindfulness'
take care
mick
-
GirlcalledGed
- Posts: 25
Thank you,
Lovely advice. I don't take any of it as negative criticism. Being present is very new to me. I have spent all my life being totally pre-occupied with what I need to do to make my life ok and lived in a fantasy world most of the time. Dreaming about the future when things will be ok. Totally detached from the present moment. Just getting through each day in hope of a different future where I am happy, confident, energised and at peace with myself. I honestly had no idea this wasn't how everyone thought until I discovered mindfulness! So those anti-mindful groves in my brain are very deep.
I am often finding myself outside of the present moment. Even the title of this post is. I have been completely pre-occupied with moving recently. To Orkney in fact, 500 miles away. Obsessed with finding the right place and planning a life there. I think that might have just died though.
I am not too worried about the insomnia. It was horrific for about a year but i know it now. The odd night of it isn't a problem. Not that I rembered that the other night. In hindsight I wish I had focussed in on the pounding heart sensation, at the time it frightened me.
My eating is still terrible but I think I am accepting it. Accepting the crappy feelings that come with it. I would normally be fantasising about tomorrow when I get control of it (and using that as justification for eating up all the bad food today)
I still haven't been formally meditating much but did the self compassion one you posted and bring attention to everyday stuff.
Thank you so much for your advice and insight. It is very very welcome
Xx
Lovely advice. I don't take any of it as negative criticism. Being present is very new to me. I have spent all my life being totally pre-occupied with what I need to do to make my life ok and lived in a fantasy world most of the time. Dreaming about the future when things will be ok. Totally detached from the present moment. Just getting through each day in hope of a different future where I am happy, confident, energised and at peace with myself. I honestly had no idea this wasn't how everyone thought until I discovered mindfulness! So those anti-mindful groves in my brain are very deep.
I am often finding myself outside of the present moment. Even the title of this post is. I have been completely pre-occupied with moving recently. To Orkney in fact, 500 miles away. Obsessed with finding the right place and planning a life there. I think that might have just died though.
I am not too worried about the insomnia. It was horrific for about a year but i know it now. The odd night of it isn't a problem. Not that I rembered that the other night. In hindsight I wish I had focussed in on the pounding heart sensation, at the time it frightened me.
My eating is still terrible but I think I am accepting it. Accepting the crappy feelings that come with it. I would normally be fantasising about tomorrow when I get control of it (and using that as justification for eating up all the bad food today)
I still haven't been formally meditating much but did the self compassion one you posted and bring attention to everyday stuff.
Thank you so much for your advice and insight. It is very very welcome
Xx
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piedwagtail91
- Posts: 613
- Practice Mindfulness Since: 0- 3-2011
- Location: Lancashire witch country
you've made a great start, you're very aware.
the only moment you can live in is this one.
i was the same with my depression always in the future or in the past.
i rode a 100 mile ride once just because it had felt good in the past.
when i didn't feel good when i got to the part of the ride i liked, it was a very hard ride home as punishment.
i wish i'd known then what i know now.
if you don't feel like practicing a formal meditation then don't and don't feel bad.
if you can bring your awareness to the moment using 'everyday mindfulness' using things like making a brew, listening to the birds or watching it rain, applying the skills you have then that'll do until you do feel like it.
you need only do this for a few minutes at a time, it'll give you a break from yourself
gradually those grooves will wear away, just like waves on the sea gradualy grow calm.
take one step at a time and feel good about it.
take care
mick
the only moment you can live in is this one.
i was the same with my depression always in the future or in the past.
i rode a 100 mile ride once just because it had felt good in the past.
when i didn't feel good when i got to the part of the ride i liked, it was a very hard ride home as punishment.
i wish i'd known then what i know now.
if you don't feel like practicing a formal meditation then don't and don't feel bad.
if you can bring your awareness to the moment using 'everyday mindfulness' using things like making a brew, listening to the birds or watching it rain, applying the skills you have then that'll do until you do feel like it.
you need only do this for a few minutes at a time, it'll give you a break from yourself
gradually those grooves will wear away, just like waves on the sea gradualy grow calm.
take one step at a time and feel good about it.
take care
mick
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GirlcalledGed
- Posts: 25
I am panicked that I am going to lose it completely. That I'll go back to square 1 and it will be a massive struggle again. Shouldn't I push myself to meditate every day? I am scared I am going to sabotage this like I do with everything good that I get. I guess that's because I don't feel any self compassion but I could just stay this way forever. I have been this way forever. Try something new and then walk away back to my old self after a while. Search for the next thing. Only mindfulness is different. There is no alternative, I know that. So I am still a bit stuck, driving myself crazy. Thinking of which course, or book I need which is just more of the same as I have always done
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piedwagtail91
- Posts: 613
- Practice Mindfulness Since: 0- 3-2011
- Location: Lancashire witch country
Try not to worry yourself too much. Those are thoughts. It's normal to think that.
It's best not to push or force yourself.
That'll make it something you're tolerating and it won't last.
Encouraging yourself to sit for a few minutes at a time would be better.
But you're struggling with self compassion which makes that harder.
But try not to force yourself.
I think Gareth and Jon have both had success by mediating to music.
Would that help you?
You'd need their advice on that though as I've only dabbled with it listening to my chemical romance - jons gone for earplugs
This bit is really hard to accept but if you do slip back It's not failure, it's experience you've gained.
It's not the end, really it's not.
it means you can give it another go with all the experience you've gained.
Just like when your mind wanders and you go back to the breath.
None of this is easy I know.
But try not to worry about things you can't control? The worries that it may not work. They really are thoughts with no proof.
There's a quote floating around which says "try not to think about the things that might go wrong, but think about the things that can go right". But be realistic. One moment at a time.
It's best not to push or force yourself.
That'll make it something you're tolerating and it won't last.
Encouraging yourself to sit for a few minutes at a time would be better.
But you're struggling with self compassion which makes that harder.
But try not to force yourself.
I think Gareth and Jon have both had success by mediating to music.
Would that help you?
You'd need their advice on that though as I've only dabbled with it listening to my chemical romance - jons gone for earplugs
This bit is really hard to accept but if you do slip back It's not failure, it's experience you've gained.
It's not the end, really it's not.
it means you can give it another go with all the experience you've gained.
Just like when your mind wanders and you go back to the breath.
None of this is easy I know.
But try not to worry about things you can't control? The worries that it may not work. They really are thoughts with no proof.
There's a quote floating around which says "try not to think about the things that might go wrong, but think about the things that can go right". But be realistic. One moment at a time.
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GirlcalledGed
- Posts: 25
You are spot on again, thank you Mick
I just did a long sitting meditation. It's how I started, the JKZ ones. They were like toture a year ago. Physically and mentally. The boredom and restlessness but eventually I allowed myself to buy a zafu and once the 8 week course was finished I generally selected a 20 minute JKZ meditation.
Doing the sitting meditation I was aware I was thinking 'I need to do this everyday' which I know isn't good or helpful but I did realise how far I have come. I haven't had the big tranformations that I had in the early stages which I think I have been hoping for but maybe aren't really required any more. All the times I have been thinking that I have been going backwards or stagnant have contributed in a good way too. I am not sure what I am trying to say here, just that I don't think I have ruined anything after all. Even though I ate absolute rubbish today. I ate and fed my child mcdonalds. I am embarrassed to admit it. I worry for his soul eating that junk but I found a good enough excuse at the time and can't change it now. Is that acceptance?
Thank you again xx
I just did a long sitting meditation. It's how I started, the JKZ ones. They were like toture a year ago. Physically and mentally. The boredom and restlessness but eventually I allowed myself to buy a zafu and once the 8 week course was finished I generally selected a 20 minute JKZ meditation.
Doing the sitting meditation I was aware I was thinking 'I need to do this everyday' which I know isn't good or helpful but I did realise how far I have come. I haven't had the big tranformations that I had in the early stages which I think I have been hoping for but maybe aren't really required any more. All the times I have been thinking that I have been going backwards or stagnant have contributed in a good way too. I am not sure what I am trying to say here, just that I don't think I have ruined anything after all. Even though I ate absolute rubbish today. I ate and fed my child mcdonalds. I am embarrassed to admit it. I worry for his soul eating that junk but I found a good enough excuse at the time and can't change it now. Is that acceptance?
Thank you again xx
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