Bad people

[Peter]

Hi Steve, it's amazing that this is still effecting you after 5 years. I can tell you that it is indeed very trivial. What's 50-60 hours of a lifetime? You're blaming a lot of stuff to the incident. And you keep wishing it hadn't happened. That wish is never gonna come true. You don't have to understand the motivations of this guy. It's just something that happened. Move on! I think you are probably already aware of all this, and it will probably not help you. May I ask what your mindfulness history is?
Peter

[steveburns04]

Sorry Peter its all very complicated. It was the events that occured because i was distracted by that work. it was at a crucial time and i ended up being unemployed for 3-4 months afterwards. I cannot blame him for being distracted by that work, but the fact it ended up being a trick is what affects me. It actually had a domino effect such as putting me behind by one year at university. As I said at the same time something very serious happened to a family member which affects him to this day, and due to my own problem at the time I could not help them. Its simply the fact all this happened, and in the end that work ended up being a trick, my life would have been so much simpler if I had never met the guy.

I have only started mindfulness in the past three weeks. It made the feelings worse to begin with, as I normally fantasise to get away from reality. I know I just need to keep at it though.
Your words are wise Peter, and I agree with what you are saying

[barbs55]

Hello, this is Barbara (I look after the Everyday Mindfulness Facebook page), and I want to add to this very interesting thread. I am finding it personally very helpful, particularly Peter's contribution here:

"I've noticed that also in personal relationships, my thought process has simplified significantly. If someone familiar interacts not so nicely, I ask myself, did I do something 'wrong'? If I think I didn't, I'm moving on. If I'm not sure, I'll ask or clarify my actions. The closer someone is to me, the more I try to notice distress, and talk about it. If there's something I did wrong, I acknowledge it, and try my best to do it differently in the future. I don't (anymore) try to analyse or interpret what the motivations of the other person might be until they've become apparent. This way of thinking/feeling gives a lot of peace. It isn't something I've told myself to do, but it is what mindfulness and meditation has steered me towards."

Analysis, and interpreting other people's actions/motivations/feelings is what takes me away from mindfulness every time. And like Steve I can be doing this for things that happened 30 years ago! Meditation and mindfulness has helped me to notice and be aware and catch myself doing this, so I can begin to let it go (or 'let it be' as Jon Kabat-Zinn usefully puts it), but it does still arise a lot of the time.

I agree with fabiG that having a compassion practice has helped me to realise that I will never know what the driver who cut me up is struggling with, and that helps to let it be. (I don't really believe that there are 'bad people' just people who have had terrible things done to them which they now pass on.) I also think that we have to be compassionate to ourselves, Steve, when someone has treated us so badly it DOES hurt and we can acknowledge that hurt, and feel sorry for ourselves. As Gareth says, it is OK to be angry. But it is an old hurt, and it is not being self-compassionate to keep replaying it in our minds when it belongs back then.

I am definitely adding to my list of 'useful things to say to myself', Peter's
"We can also learn to accept that we don't know why, and it's just something that happened."

As usual it all comes back to acceptance of what is. It happened to you, Steve, and you can accept that it did, and it was unpleasant, but it is not happening now, in this moment, except in your thoughts. And thoughts are not facts, and not always true, even if they tell you they are.

I wanted to contribute to this debate because I think even 'experienced' meditators, and people who have been trying to be mindful everyday, are still disarmed by this kind of event, and this is indeed a lifetime journey.

[Peter]

Thank you very much Barbara. I think a lot of people will find solace in your words!
Peter

[Peter]

@Steve. It's really striking to me that you just keep explaining the situation. Even here, you can't get passed it; you need to know why this happened to you. You need to understand though that it doesn't matter what the consequences were. A lot of the things you are calling consequences are very debatable, but that's another story. These things are done! You will never be able to change them! For the outcome it doesn't matter why the guy did this; these things happened, no matter what his motivations were.

I understand that these are just words and will not really help you, so I think you've made a wise decision investigating mindfulness.

I would advice to take a course; either with a group or using a book. Stop explaining the situation or looking for answers, just concentrate on mindfulness for now!

Peter

[fabiG]

I have only started mindfulness in the past three weeks. It made the feelings worse to begin with, as I normally fantasise to get away from reality. I know I just need to keep at it though.

This sounds very similar to me. And I think that this is in itself quite a revealing insight.

However, don't think that "just keeping at it" will make it disappear. It probably won't. And please notice that the effect of mindfulness is hardly visible. It is a very incremental process. On that road, you will feel hurt again, but with the contribution of mindfulness you will firstly be compassionate to you in these periods and secondly also "learn" something, as Rumi indicated in one of his poems. Not necessarily something that you can apply directly to your current situation, but for your life in general. It might take you time, but it is definitely worth it.

Fabian

[Peter]

Very good point Fabian! Everybody needs to understand that Mindfulness is a very gradual process. For me, it was life changing from the start, it was mind blowing even; within days it changed so much. After a while it continued to develop, but much more slowly, and it still does. I know that it was like that for JonW also. But for a lot of people it isn't so mind blowing. For the 'end result' it doesn't matter how it started. Don't be put off by a lack of results. Just try to enjoy the practice. That's it.
Peter

[fabiG]

Well, Peter, it's quite interesting to read your comment, because I thought to myself earlier when I started the practices "hey, everybody says that mindfulness has an instant effect on them, but I don't experience that, am I doing something wrong...?"...

Reading your post has just made me realize that I completely stopped thinking like that, in fact I even forgot it...and I'm really happy about that ;-)

[JonW]

Yes, what Peter said. Mindfulness proved to be immediately transformative for me. For many people the process is very gradual. It helps to resist making comparisons with how other people are doing. This is about YOUR experience.
Jon

[Gareth]

Just try to enjoy the practice. That's it.

Or don't enjoy it...whatever. Just practise consistently, and learn about the concepts behind it; that's the main thing.