A newbie trying to piece it together!

[JonW]

Excellent post, Humph. Love your descriptions. It sounds to me like you have a good grasp of mindfulness already.
Welcome to the forum btw. It's great to have a fellow Gil Scott-Heron fan on here!
Hope to see a lot more of you on this forum.
All best wishes,
Jon, Hove

[Humph]

Thank you both Jon & Paul. It's one thing to know it, it's another to practice it;)

[aly4519]

great responses here!

Been very diligent in meditation, still find myself lost in thought. even if I notice I'm lost in thought, and come back to the present, it's very brief.

[1Daveatatime]

Jon Kabat-Zinn says that it's like working out your mindfulness muscle, by continually returning to the present object of attention, even if briefly.

Pema Chodron says that even the meditation sessions that feel like "bad" ones are, in fact, not at all - that the returning IS the practice - staying focused is not, in itself, the point.

And Allan Lokos says that he's often asked who is a good meditator and his answer is simply "one who meditates."

Clearly, I don't have an original thought of my own about this stuff, but those are some of the things that have helped me keep on the path.

[JonW]

Great quotes, 1dave. Thanks for those.
Cheers,
Jon

[Matt Y]

Been very diligent in meditation, still find myself lost in thought.

Being a meditation teacher, I hear this refrain frequently; often in the second week of a course, and sometimes even after the very first guided meditation we complete. I find it difficult not to laugh. As if we should be able to master our minds in a matter of hours, or days, or even months.

I think it's good to compare progress in meditation with aging. It's going on continually, but you don't notice it from day to day.

Or you could compare it with learning to walk; which takes most of us about a year. Imagine a 6 week old baby complaining: "Mum. I still haven't learnt to walk!"

But even these analogies can be misleading - because they suggest that we might one day have perfect control over our minds, and also that this would be a good thing.

What is wrong with being lost in thought? Does it hurt anyone? Does it make you a bad person? Could it be helpful? What is the purpose of such thinking? These are serious questions. I'm not being flippant asking them.

Also, why do we assume that we should be able to perfect these techniques, and also that by doing so will benefit? Whose advice are we following, and on what basis?

[Carl]

great responses here!

Been very diligent in meditation, still find myself lost in thought. even if I notice I'm lost in thought, and come back to the present, it's very brief.

Hi Aly. I'm new here and thought I'd chime in. I started mindfulness mediation a little over a year ago. It was recommended to me by an Audiologist to help me cope with Tinnitus which was the result of a bad car accident. I was told that it could help me learn to tune out the ringing in my ear which never goes away. After an 8 week class which included daily meditation I grew frustrated because it didn't seem to help at all. At the end of the class on the final night, the instructor, aware of my reasons for being in the class gave me a copy of The Miracle of Mindfulness and urged me to read it and keep at the daily meditations.

I decided to read the book and keep at the practice because at the very least, I did feel better immediately after daily meditations...just calmer in an overall sense, if even only for 20-30 minutes. I'm not exactly sure when it happened, but one day I realized that if I turned my attention to my breath when trying to fall asleep, I was able to actually tune out the ringing in my ear. That was sort of a light bulb moment for me that made me realize that the Mindfulness practice was having a positive benefit. I guess after 8 weeks of classes and meditation practice which covered around 60 days, and another couple of weeks reading that book, I figure it was somewhere around 75 days when I realized tangible benefit....But it wasn't achieved until after I sort of dropped my expectations and just rolled with it.

I also signed up for Headspace and have been using it for quite a while. I find it useful for structure and do use it, but what I've found most successful is just focusing on one meditative activity as a daily practice at least for now, as a beginner, rather than bouncing from what Headspace uses which is sitting in a chair, or walking meditations or others activities. Oddly, I've found washing dishes to be a really effective meditative activity for me, which I think I got from Thich Nhat Hanh's Miracle of Mindfulness or something else he wrote...It seems to work for me, and I've also gotten the added benefit of now being everyone's favorite invited guest at family gatherings like Thanksgiving because I'm volunteering to wash dishes.

[aly4519]

Been very diligent in meditation, still find myself lost in thought.

Being a meditation teacher, I hear this refrain frequently; often in the second week of a course, and sometimes even after the very first guided meditation we complete. I find it difficult not to laugh. As if we should be able to master our minds in a matter of hours, or days, or even months.

I think it's good to compare progress in meditation with aging. It's going on continually, but you don't notice it from day to day.

Or you could compare it with learning to walk; which takes most of us about a year. Imagine a 6 week old baby complaining: "Mum. I still haven't learnt to walk!"

But even these analogies can be misleading - because they suggest that we might one day have perfect control over our minds, and also that this would be a good thing.

What is wrong with being lost in thought? Does it hurt anyone? Does it make you a bad person? Could it be helpful? What is the purpose of such thinking? These are serious questions. I'm not being flippant asking them.

Also, why do we assume that we should be able to perfect these techniques, and also that by doing so will benefit? Whose advice are we following, and on what basis?

these are great points. Eyeopening for sure. thank you

[Matt Y]

Glad you found those points worth considering Aly.

Also, upon re-reading my previous post I thought it worth mentioning that upon reflection I would have to say that - after a couple of decades of meditation and mindfulness practice - I would say that the most useful skill I've learnt is the ability to sit and enjoy my thoughts, even if they take up every moment of my practice.

[aly4519]

I find it very frustrating at times. To be doing something work related, and read something that I know is true, and then to start to question myself; "what if I forget this is true?" "what will that mean for my career?" "will it keep from me getting done what I need to do?"

I've even found this trigger to be impacting my mindfulness; "what if i forget how to be present?"

Sounds crazy, but it's me!