Everyday Mindfulness

Does anyone think that there is a significant difference between the mindfulness 'movement' in the UK and the US?

For example, the NHS (what remains of it ) can provide the course free to UK citizens, while in the US it seems people have to pay more often. Do you think something like this is, and will continue to, significantly affect the development of Mindfulness groups, facilities, and general practice within the respective countries?

How about stances on religion and the influence of Buddhism on the culture? The USA seems more dedicated to religion and Christianity than the UK, for example.

Does anyone have experience in both countries?

Who would win in a fist-fight between Jon Kabat-Zinn and Mark Williams? - JOKE .........(My money's on Zinn).

BioSattva wrote:Who would win in a fist-fight between Jon Kabat-Zinn and Mark Williams? - JOKE .........(My money's on Zinn).

Made me chuckle!

I do not know about the differences between the UK and US, however you did touch on something there which I think outlines a clear division in accessibility to, and practice of, mindfulness: socioeconomic factors!

Obviously the UK is deeply marred by socioeconomic division: it is well rooted in our history (as with most post-industrial countries, now that I think of it). I remember once commenting to my dad that had I been brought up in a working class household I probably never would have had access to the resources necessary to essentially 'discover' mindfulness. My own personal discovery of mindfulness was through university where a meditation (not mindfulness) course was being given at the student counselling centre. My natural line of enquiry led me to mindfulness - and lo here I am today! They say university is open to all, but I think time will reveal that this is hard position to defend in the face of £9,000 a year university fees!!

Had I not been in that university environment initially, I might never have come to mindfulness. I have friends with anxiety disorders who would likely consider themselves from working class backgrounds. Their social context appears to somewhat limit them in their motivation to trust in alternatives outside of conventionally acceptable norms. Fortunately, as you say, mindfulness is now free on the NHS and so perhaps it will come more to the fore. Moreover I notice that it is now being in taught in some schools, in addition to being readily available on the internet. Hopefully this might have the impact of making it more accessible where before it might have been a fairly atypical route.

Obviously this is one massive macro-social brush I am painting with. Each individual is different and will be driven to seek different tools that are available to them. However, it is just my observation that for the time being that mindfulness practice is likely more easily accessed from a position of relative privilege.

I do wonder if this theory would translate to the US where there exists massive socioeconomic division but with perhaps subtle and nuanced differences to the UK.

Or maybe the whole thing is just a discourse I have layered over my own misguided perception of 'the way things are' and, actually, has no bearing on reality I'm not usually one for quantitative analysis, but perhaps a better understanding of who exactly practices mindfulness would confer some more evidence-based observations of the role that class has to play.

Sorry if I went off on a tangent here! I realise that was not at all the question you had initially asked

It's true that mindfulness is being offered free on the NHS but I'm not sure how many health authorities do offer it as an option. A couple of weekends ago I spent some time with a friend of a friend who has taught mindfulness within the NHS and she mentioned that there is a problem with badly-trained teachers. She mentioned one guy whose idea of teaching a session was to press "play" on a CD player and leave the group to it. Mind you, he didn't last long.
Her theory is that there will always be people who are drawn to teaching anything for the wrong reasons. Certainly Brighton, where I live, has a reputation for being awash with cowboy therapists, acupuncturists etc.
I'm planning to start my teacher training in October btw.

ps.
My money would be on JKZ to beat Williams in a third-round KO with a powerful left-hook.
As for the bout that the world was waiting for, Alan "Bruiser" Watts v Jiddu Krishnamurti, we can only imagine. The tear-up was meant to happen at Madison Square Garden but Krishnamurti cried off with an ingrowing toenail at the last minute. It is said that tickets for the cancelled bout sold out faster than those for the recent Stone Roses tour. As you probably know, Krishnamurti was eventually forced to retire from professional boxing after suffering a detached retina in a street brawl with Smokin' Joe Frazier in '74.

JonW wrote:ps.
My money would be on JKZ to beat Williams in a third-round KO with a powerful left-hook.
As for the bout that the world was waiting for, Alan "Bruiser" Watts v Jiddu Krishnamurti, we can only imagine. The tear-up was meant to happen at Madison Square Garden but Krishnamurti cried off with an ingrowing toenail at the last minute. It is said that tickets for the cancelled bout sold out faster than those for the recent Stone Roses tour. As you probably know, Krishnamurti was eventually forced to retire from professional boxing after suffering a detached retina in a street brawl with Smokin' Joe Frazier in '74.

Indeed, there's a long and distinguished history of well-known Buddhists excelling in the field of athletic endeavour. For instance, Ramana Maharshi enjoyed a spell up front with The Spurs in the late forties and was widely renowned for his prowess in the air. At White Hart Lane they still remember fondly Ramana's last minute goal against Norwich City in the 1939 Cup semi-final when he rose like a freshwater salmon at the far post to head the winner past Gerry "The Cat" Fogerty. In his spare time, Ramana enjoyed nothing more than a spot of nude wrestling.